Originally Posted by A Muppet

3. If you 'need' a necromancer for Bip or Br... then just give up.
Long, drawn out fights will eventually sap a monks energy to nothing. So if after around 45 seconds of fighting you need a bit of Bip or BR to give a boost to your energy regen, okay, fine.

Originally Posted by A Muppet

Finally, ritualists have a trump card: skills that give them energy, which means less dependence on the necromancers, and usually the ability to keep healing in long, drawn out fights.

Originally Posted by LouAl

Wow, just wow. So, let me get this straight...you think monks are good for healing, but ritualists are better, right? You also think that protection prayers are worthlesss and smiting is good?

Remove deep wound and then cast a heal? Why not just use Mend Ailment and remove it while giving a solid heal at the same time (or Restore Conditions)?

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

Right, before we go any further, let's get the basics established...

1. I have 9 characters. One of everything, barring mesmer. (simply because they don't suit my style.)
2. I have beaten all 3 chapters with all 9 characters.
3. I have all the skills for 6 out of 9 of these characters, and most of the others for the rest.
4. I am pve only. So as far as I'm concerned this doesn't apply to pvp.
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That aside, here's my thoughts after playing Gw for over 2 years, and my experiences as a monk in pve.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

1. Healing Breeze sucks. Anyone who brings it is a twerp.
Vigerous spirit for general purpose healing is simply better. It lasts longer, it doesn't cost as much, it has a faster recharge, and for an attacking warrior, ranger, assassin, dervish it buffers poison and bleeding perfectly as well as heals.
For the assassin and barrage rangers in particuler it's a very potent healing spell. Hell, put it on yourself, so you can heal away most of that fireball's damage while you're healing the rest of the team.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

2. Heal Party is awful.
Energy:Health ratio, it is Just. Not. Worth it.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

3. If you 'need' a necromancer for Bip or Br... then just give up.
Long, drawn out fights will eventually sap a monks energy to nothing. So if after around 45 seconds of fighting you need a bit of Bip or BR to give a boost to your energy regen, okay, fine.
Needing it after using four skills (Healing Breeze twice, Heal Party and Heal Other is a classic) a mark of an imbecile who expects another class to prop up their inadequecies at managing their energy and poor skill selections.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

4. Smiting is good.
Scourge Healing on a group can build a very nasty preassure build, even against powerful healers like Shadow monks. Just systematically place it on every enemy in the party-starting with the monk-and watch the monk kill himself. If he heals an ally, he gets blasted. If he heals himself, his self healing is buffered by the Scourge Healing.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

Judges Insight makes the person benefitting from it holy damage. That's double damage to all undead such as skeletons in the fissure. Even if you're not fighting undead, 20% armour penetration isn't to be sniffed at.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

Strength of Honour can make a good melee damage dealer into a *very* good damage dealer. +11 melee damage to their attacks. Coupled with Judge's Insight, and then some actual attack skills by the class with Strength of Honour on them means you have something nasty.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

And as for actual attacking skills, Signet of Judgement and Bane Signet are both good for Knockdowns and spear of Light can take over 100 health off a target-200 if it's undead. Not bad for a 5 energy spell.

5. I'd rather have a ritualist healing.
For raw healing power, I've found ritualists with all-out restoration magic easily match my monk, usually exceed. Things like Mend Body and Soul to be especially good-a healing spell that removes a condition while in earshot of a spirit, just to name one good example, let alone handy mass healings like Life.

But monks can remove conditions like Mend Body and Soul? Yes they can, but those are relegated to protection, which means at best you're going to remove that deep wound then cast a healing spell, or detract points from Healing into Protection to make that condition removal do some healing that's actually worth something.
As for monks mass healing? Heal Area is about the only decent mass heal, and that has obvious problems. Finally, a healer monk will need high divine favour as well as high healing prayers to heal effectively. Ritualists just need high Restoration, which means they have the potential to pack a few offensive skills too, offensive skills that will actually have a tangible benefit.

Originally Posted by A_Muppet

Finally, ritualists have a trump card: skills that give them energy, which means less dependence on the necromancers, and usually the ability to keep healing in long, drawn out fights.
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The point of the above isn't 'OMGZ YOU SUCK' flamebait, it's just experiences I've found playing as a monk. Whether you choose to actually read, pay attention, assimilate and apply what I've typed is your choice.

Originally Posted by Twinsoul

Orison of Healing
Ethereal Light
Dwayna's Kiss
Healing Touch
Heal Party
Divine Spirit
Healer's Boon
Rebirth

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Oh My Gawd.

I really don't know where to start. I mean, wow. This is bad, even for PvE. Sigh, I guess I'll start at the top of your post.

The fact that you have been through 36 chapters in PvE isn't giving you alot of credit. Unless you invented the 55, PvE statistics are probably going to discredit you, if anything. PvP is where you can start to gain some credit for your knowledge, since this is the harder of the two. Just as an example: If I were a private, I would much rather take advice from a general who has spent 10 years getting to where he is at than another private who has been one for 10 years. Do you follow what I am saying? You can drag PvP experience into PvE and be successful. You can NOT drag PvE experience into PvP and be (as) successful.

Healing Breeze, yea. It's hated just about as much as mending and has half the ammount of humorous jokes to go with it. I could agree with you here.

Heal Party, before LoD, was one of the most efficient healing spells around.
At twelve healing, Heal Party heals 8 people for 67 health, for 15 energy.
8x67 = 536, 536/15 = 35.733 Health Healed per Energy Point Lost.

Assuming 12 Healing and 12 Divine:
Orison of Healing:
60+38.4 = 98.4, 98.4x8 = 787.2 Health Healed for (5x8) 40 Energy.
787.2/40 = 19.68 Health Healed per Energy Point Lost.

Heal Other:
151+38.4 = 189.4, 189.4x8 = 1515.2 Health Healed for (10x8) 80 Energy.
1515.2/80 = 18.94 Health Healed per Energy Point Lost.

Gift of Health:
123+38.4 = 161.4, 161.4x8 = 1291.2 Health Healed for (5x8) 40 Energy.
1291.2/40 = 32.28 Health Healed per Energy Point Lost.

In summary, Heal Party is more efficient than the mighty Gift of Health, assuming everyone is receiving the full benefit. I will say, in your defense, that Heal Party is NOT best used on monks, simply because it is very costly; it was used on elementalists (no divine favor needed) to further increase efficiency. Efficiency is the key to proper energy management, but this point is best saved for, oh, right now!

If you are running out of Energy in 45 seconds, there is still a problem. Imagine, monks in gvg hold their energy for over 20 minutes, and their team is constantly under attack! Stick with 5 energy skills and you should manage your energy a bit better. Anyone who is packing Heal Party and Heal Other on their bar better be a Healer's Boon. See above for Healing Breeze.

With the exception of Scouge Healing in certain GvG Hex Builds, Shield of Judgement for farming, and Smite Hex in rare situations now, Smiting is not good. Ever. Who cares if you can do 200 damage in a single hit. You don't need distractions from monking, especially in high-end PvE.

You are correct in saying that ritualists beat monks in power healing. This is true. A spammable 170 health heal? Rock on. BUT, ritualists require spirits for most of their power heals. The only money skills (restoration) a ritualist really has are Weapon of Remedy, Weilder's Boon, and Weapon of Warding. They are nearly unconditional and effective. Skills such as Spirit Light and Mend Body and Soul depend on other spirits to be around! "Conditionality" is one of the biggest skill-wreckers that exists in guild wars. The more conditional mods placed on a skill, the less it is used (RoF being the biggest exception). As far as Ritualists having skills that grant them energy, read above. Monks also have secondary professions for that :]

Finally, the best monk is a hybrid. Why go 12 Healing, 12 Divine, and 3 X when you could go 10 Divine, 10 Prot, 11 Healing? Now you can mitigate damage and heal it as well!

Sigh, long post. I usually leave these posts alone but I just had to say something!